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MadStorkSports
01-17-2012, 20:03
I couldn't help but notice how many NFL analysts
and announcers were almost going out of there way
to proclaim Eli Manning as an Elite quarterback
yesterday. By that I don't mean that they were
saying he was a "GREAT" quarterback, I mean they were
all making it a point to use the word "ELITE".

To me this was a clear indication that the fact that
many of you, and even some of them didn't believe he
deserved that title, was a thought that was out there.
The ESPN Twitter feed even Tweeted this after the game:
<blockquote>
Eli Manning’s Career Playoff Victims: Aaron Rodgers,
Matt Ryan, Tom Brady, Brett Favre, Tony Romo, Jeff Garcia</blockquote>

You can't help but notice that, that is quite the list,
and that "if" he wins the Super Bowl again this season
this he will either add Joe Flacco to that list or double
up on Tom Brady, and the latter is even more impressive.
For those of you who for years have been of the school
that Peyton is so much better than Eli, and I was one of
you, I will go on record as saying that is has reached the
point that Peyton is still better, but by very, little.
Thing is "if" he does go on to win that Super Bowl, he
will have two titles, and be two for two, whereas Peyton
will have just one, and be one for two.

I've said this before, and it's always worth repeating:
<i>perception is reality</i>, and since Eli does not come off
as one of the more cerebral players in the league, the
initial impression is that he's dumb, and he has clearly
shown that, that is the furthest thing form the truth.
No matter how much you try and avoid that sort of thinking
we are all guilty of it at some point. I guess that works
the other why too. It's probably why I think that Heisman
Trophy winner RG III is going to be a great pro. he is so
polished and well versed ion front of the camera, that he
leads you to believe that he is bright, in command, and
destined for success.

Anyway you want to slice this, he's earned it. I mentioned
in an earlier <a href="http://madstorksports.blogspot.com/2012/01/is-breaking-marino-record-impressive.html">piece</a> that I wasn't very impressed with the
breaking of Dan Marino's record by Drew Brees, as much as
I think he's a great Quarterback, because of how much both
Wide receivers and Quarterbacks receive these days as opposed
to when Marino broke the record, and yet in the same breath
I will tell you that he finished 67 yards shy of 5000 yards,
and 543 behind Brees, even though Brees had 68 more passing
attempts than Eli, about two games worth really of you figure
the typical QB throws about 34 passes per game. Just for fun
though, if you take that many attempts and multiply it by his
completion percentage, then Eli would have only finished a
mere 223 yards behind Brees, but that's all just speculation,
and theory. What isn't speculation and theory is that Eli is
still in this thing and Drew and that guy named Tebow are home
getting all healed up for next season. Time to step up, Eli
has more than arrived and Giants fans as well as fans around
the league need to now understand what they have.

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The Boss
01-17-2012, 21:56
This "give Eli his credit" stuff really should wait until we know what happens the rest of the way. Your list of conquered doesnt mean much. Hell, Sanchez has beaten Rivers, Manning (the better one) and Brady, all on the road, in his first 2 years. Am I saying that means he's great? Hell no. Point is that stuff doesnt mean much. Like I said, I need to see what happens this week before I can evaluate his season

BJ
01-18-2012, 11:39
Come on now..You really have to be blind to not realize Eli is elite in this league..Dont get me wrong,he dont come close to being elite throughout NFL history, but in this new NFL the one where Cam Newton dominates he is..This is a whole different sport know.With more pass inteference calls,illegal contact, I mean u cant sneeze near a receiver the days without a ref throwing a flag..Add on top of that, you cant touch a QB or its an automatic !st down,its not that difficult for a QB who can throw a ball down field to be above average..2 reasons in my opinion why Eli is consiered Elite.1-No good defenses anymore in football make him look better than he is and 2- his competition at the QB position is awful..Brady,Brees,Rodgers, and Eli ..am i wrong ?

ss12108
01-18-2012, 22:48
I'm still in the group of people saying there's "tiers" to the QB's. Brady, Brees, Rodgers, Healthy Peyton are in a class of their own. They are "elite". Then there's the next class of Eli, Big Ben, Rivers (even w/o a SB), and even the underrated Shaub. This second class is still a group of QB's that can single handedly take over a game, but they just aren't on par with those other guys. That's not a knock at all...the first group includes 2 surefire HOF's, and 2 very likely HOF's. Brady and elder Manning are in discussions as a couple of the best ever at the position.

He's just not there...yet. Brees has gotten better and better with every passing season, and there's no reason Eli can't keep building on what he's accomplished this year. Frankly though, the only reason all these analysts call him "elite" lately is because they live in the moment and because of Eli's comments earlier in the year. How many times have you heard these guys call a player "possibly the best we've ever seen" and a month later say the same thing about someone else?

ss12108
01-18-2012, 22:54
And 2 other points:

1. You can't extrapolate Eli's stats to compare his season to Brees. Its not an accurate comparison, and things like batted balls, interceptions, dropped passes, etc would have to be taken into account with it to even make it somewhat useful. Eli had a great season but it wasn't on par with Brees.

2. No one ever considers Eli dumb. The only knock there's ever been on Eli has been his propensity for turnovers...you know those plays where instead of throwing it away, or taking the sack to save 3 points, he fades away while tossing an underhand left-handed attempt to a receiver in double coverage? He's eliminated quite a bit of those head scratching plays this year which is why he's shown he is capable of being one of the best signal callers in the league.

MrBathgate
01-18-2012, 23:04
Eli is Elite plain and simple (and im a Jets/Niners fan). In the beginning fans made fun of his ho hum type of attitude but now everyone sees he just has ice in his veins.

The Boss
01-19-2012, 07:21
I'm still in the group of people saying there's "tiers" to the QB's. Brady, Brees, Rodgers, Healthy Peyton are in a class of their own. They are "elite". Then there's the next class of Eli, Big Ben, Rivers (even w/o a SB), and even the underrated Shaub. This second class is still a group of QB's that can single handedly take over a game, but they just aren't on par with those other guys. That's not a knock at all...the first group includes 2 surefire HOF's, and 2 very likely HOF's. Brady and elder Manning are in discussions as a couple of the best ever at the position.

He's just not there...yet. Brees has gotten better and better with every passing season, and there's no reason Eli can't keep building on what he's accomplished this year. Frankly though, the only reason all these analysts call him "elite" lately is because they live in the moment and because of Eli's comments earlier in the year. How many times have you heard these guys call a player "possibly the best we've ever seen" and a month later say the same thing about someone else?

All great point from a big time Giant fan. He might be the #5 QB in the league, but the word elite should not be used. also, the man is not better then he was a month ago. And he would not be any worse if the defense failed in Tampa and 2007 never happens. Sometimes as fans we use the end result to evaluate a persons skills too much.

Bobcat
01-19-2012, 11:14
First off, I am a die-hard Giants fan. On draft day, I preferred Roethlisberger and was skeptical of Eli until the Superbowl win. With all that being said, Eli is in that top tier hands down. Forget about him being a Superbowl MVP. Just look at his performance week in and week out. You can't put Roethlisberger and Rivers in the same class as Eli anymore. He is clearly up there with Brady, Brees, and Rodgers.

Whether I agree or disagree, it was a great original post and good debate back and forth.

Yankees
@TheRealBobcat

Iceman
01-20-2012, 09:55
I'm still in the group of people saying there's "tiers" to the QB's. Brady, Brees, Rodgers, Healthy Peyton are in a class of their own. They are "elite". Then there's the next class of Eli, Big Ben, Rivers (even w/o a SB), and even the underrated Shaub. This second class is still a group of QB's that can single handedly take over a game, but they just aren't on par with those other guys. That's not a knock at all...

I agree with this. Eli is probably the 4th best quaterback in the NFL. (Not counting Peyton right now, because he didn't play this year and who knows what he will be like going forward).

However, I think there is definitely a gap between the top 3 of Brees, Rodgers and Brady and Eli. It may not be as huge as it used to be, but it is definitely still there. There is still plenty of time left in Eli's career so this may change but right now I don't know if I would say he is elite. He's definitely a great quaterback though.